We’ve all been told by someone else how we should be running our business—yet their experience and knowledge may not be the best option for us. I believe we individually need to figure out what is best for business through experimenting! In today’s episode, Maryam Salassi joins us to discuss why she does things differently in her business than I do in mine and what it looked like for her to experiment in different parts of business!
The Business-First Creatives Podcast is brought to you by CRM and Dubsado expert Colie James. Join Colie each week as she discuss how to build a business that brings you joy and a paycheck! From business advice with fellow entrepreneurs to sharing automation tips and tricks, Colie and her guests are sharing industry trends and resources, along with a little bit of sarcasm.
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Guest Bio
Maryam is an award-winning family and newborn photographer based in Oakland, California.
Here are the highlights…
[1:16] Get to Know Maryam
[7:13] Film vs. Digital
[8:40] Mirrorless Cameras
[12:45] Experimenting with CRMS
[17:52] Honeybook Smart Files
[24:03] Experimenting with Simple Sales
[30:50] Pandemic Pivot: Experimenting with Smaller Packages
[32:49] New Client Experiences
[34:14] Biggest Fuck Up
Mentioned in this Episode
Dubsado – Use COLIEJAMES for 30% off your first payment, month or year!
This Can’t Be That Hard Podcast
Connect with Maryam
Review the Transcript:
Colie: Hello Welcome back to the Business First Creatives Podcast. My guest today is Maryam Salassi and she is one of my favorite humans. We have Texas in common, but now she is based out of the Bay Area in California. So Miriam, good morning and thank you for coming on podcast.
Maryam: thank you for having me. I’m excited to be here.
Colie: I mean, and the funny thing is, I wanna have you on here. The reason that I asked you to come on the podcast is because you have several very interesting stories about how you have made in your business then like went back to the original when you decided that the new one wasn’t working.
But the thing that I love about what you is that you don’t do it on a whim and you don’t like try something out for like two months and then run back, like, I’m just gonna, you know, give you guys a sneak peek. She tried Dubsado for a year and it didn’t work for her. She ran back to Honey book, which is okay.
Isn’t it interesting guys, that I’m having her on here and she is a Honey book user, an ex-Dubsado user. But before we get to any of that, let’s back up. Tell people what kind of services you offer and basically tell me the backstory of how you became a photographer. you have an education background that’s interest.
Maryam: Yeah. I am based in Oakland, California. I shoot families, newborns. Mostly in home. I love in home, during the pandemic we started venturing out on going on adventures. But really in home is where my heart is. I’m not quite documentary. I’m kind of in between documentary and lifestyle. You know, because I turned lights off, stuff like that.
Colie: Mm-hmm.
Maryam: I know the documentary people have very specific rules. I don’t always follow the rules, so
Colie: That’s
Maryam: can’t call myself
Colie: along
Maryam: But as far as my background, I have a BFA in photography. I studied fine art photography. Going back, I probably should have taken business classes , but I did. I loved my photography education, from an artist standpoint, like it was extremely eye opening and helpful. But you know, from business standpoint to really do anything for me, we learned how to like talk to galleries and stuff like that, which I have no use for.
Colie: mean, that’s fascinating though.
Maryam: it.
Colie: because I did two different career talks last week. one was online for a school in Texas and, and the middle school, and then I did a second one on Friday a middle school that’s local here in Boulder. And when I give my career talks, basically start with guys.
I’m a full-time photographer, but I do not have any formal in photography. Like my degrees are math statistics and math education. Like I tell them this and their eyes always get really wide. And then I start to think, you know, I actually don’t know that many people that have photography degree, but when they ask me if I know anyone, I’m like, Yeah, I have a friend.
She’s in California, She’s awesome. She has a great. Um, and she has a BFA in photography, so I mean, I do have you to like reference, most of the people that I know in our industry that are full-time photographers came to this world from like something else, like nursing or being a lawyer or being
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: or teacher.
Maryam: Yeah. And I used to teach, actually, I, I, I did do my, my bfa, but then I got an alternative certification to teach, and I taught art education in Dallas for, for, for a few years, before I had my daughter.
Colie: So awesome.
Maryam: yeah, it was, it was. A fun experience. I don’t know if I’d go back to teaching in public school, but you can probably relate to going back to education and
Colie: I mean, When people ask me why I became a photographer, I was like, I, I couldn’t go back to the classroom.
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: having a boss. Like, none of those things appealed to me after being at home for three years and not having anyone tell me what to do.
news flash, guys, that’s why I’m an entrepreneur.
I don’t want a boss.
Maryam: I, I will say every once in a while I’m like, I wish, I wish I just had an easy job where someone would just tell me what to do every day, , and then I’m like, Actually, I would hate that.
Colie: I mean, I think that I would love it if I had someone that kind of brokered people to me. Does that make sense? Like, I don’t wanna have a boss, but I feel like what really sucks the most energy, and this is both my photography doing Dubsado setups, like the marketing. You’re always, you know, you’re always
marketing so that you can bring people into your business.
And for photography, I am lucky. I do have a repeating cycle of, you know, photography
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: had for the last 10 years, but still, like if I was in a position right now where I wanted to still continue to grow my business. I would still have to constantly market, constantly, you know, be on social media, email, marketing ads, is that you know is actually bringing in the clients.
And sucks the energy out of me. So if I could get in a position where someone just handed me clients to like do
setups on, or photography, I mean, that would be.
Maryam: That would be nice. You need to get like a handler,
Colie: I mean,
Maryam: to,
Colie: should be someone that like goes out and like gets the clients for you and just hands them to you. And I mean guys, it’s not that these things don’t exist because for photographers, I mean like, I hate to even mention them on the photo, so you know what? I won’t. But they do have those companies that I’m sure you guys have all seen ads
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: are like, Oh, you know, your session is free and can buy something after. That is like a service that gets clients and basically gives them to you, but it also pays you Penny. It charges that client’s
you pennies. Like in the end it’s not worth it. But like I’m talking about like a higher level of service where someone will come in and actually pay my prices where someone brought them to me.
Maryam: I will say I just booked a client. At my 1995 price point that last year, they used one of those companies that charge us $59
Colie: That’s so
Maryam: they did not love the experience. So I, I, that’s, I know when like those companies pop up, people are like, Oh, they’re gonna ruin, like, we’re never gonna get clients again.
But like, if you tailor your experience and like level up your branding and just create like a. All I can say is experience. Like people will love you. Like there are people that are gonna book those $59 sessions and that might be fine for them, or they might realize that that’s not exactly what they wanted, then they’ll look for someone else, which might be you.
Colie: So you mentioned getting your branding on point. I feel like I have to give, uh, Bella Maven, Tesla love. I
give a shout out because your new website is amazing. I mean, I loved your old website, but your new
Maryam: Yeah,
Colie: But Maryam, I feel like your branding is so on point that when someone goes to your website, they know exactly what they going to get from you during the session. currently, are you still between digital and film, or are you mostly
Maryam: this plays really well into the going, changing your mind. I am. As of now, I’m mostly shooting digital. for a few reasons. During, like right before the pandemic, I was like, Okay, I’m going all in on film. I’m just gonna do every session on film. And then the pandemic happened and I was like, Well, I’m not doing any guys right now.
I took like, you know, four or five months off. and that was just enough time for me to like lose my mojo. And then like, film adds another layer of like uncertainty because you can’t see what you’re getting. And uh, I actually, my degree I learned film like that was, I, I got my degree so long ago. , I had like one digital class.
Yes. . So it was like relearning all this stuff and like, It did not feel comfortable in a way that I wasn’t comfortable because I don’t charge like pennies, you know what I mean? Like I have to deliver. And so then I started giving people the option and like half of the people were choosing like a hybrid where I was shooting film and digital.
But that’s really difficult because going back and forth is a whole thing, brain wise. and then Kodak keeps like raising the prices on film and the labs are raising their prices on developing and. just financially. I was like this, I mean, I can shoot film for myself. It doesn’t have to be for clients.
And my clients were kind of like, I mean, it’s cool
Colie: Mm-hmm.
Maryam: I don’t think they really had a preference, or could tell the difference so much. so yeah, I, I recently, well, I bought a mirrorless and then Canon release. They’re new. It’s not mirrorless. So I sent that one back and ordered the new one, the R six, mark two, I’m gonna give it, I’m gonna give it a shot.
I will say I rented two mural, three mirrors last year and hated all the colors. So it’s gonna be a learning process.
Colie: It’s gonna be a learning process. Maryam, and also, hate to tell you this, and so it’s funny, the week that this episode airs, you and I are both gonna be teaching at photo native. In
Maryam: Oh
Colie: am very much looking forward to your shoot, which I think is technically the day that this episode is gonna air. so I’m gonna ask you in person about this, but the one thing that I will say about mirrorless versus people who shoot film is mirrorless is a very sharp,
Maryam: that’s, That was my big thing. The colors and then the sharpness. It’s too sharp.
Colie: can be fixed, like you can fix the colors,
the sharpness is going to be very hard for you to get away from.
And so, mean I just feel like you’re gonna have to just go at it and then maybe you’re gonna be shooting more wide open. Because what I love about mirrorless is how sharp it is, which means that I’m like the perfect digital shooter cuz you know,
I’m gonna shoot film with you in photo native.
But in general, I’m definitely a digital girl. but like love my images to be sharp, and so that’s one of the things that I love about mirrorless, but almost every film photographer, like someone
some point has shot clients on pure film, always says that they can’t get over sharpness of the mirrorless.
Maryam: Yeah. And I’m definitely like, I’m keeping my mark for, which I’m gonna continue shooting on until I figure out like how I can make the mirrorless work, because that is one of the big issues that I had with it is, It looks sharper than I can even see with my eyes
Colie: Yes.
Maryam: which is not appealing to me. Um,
Colie: let me
Maryam: I might start shooting.
Yeah,
Colie: Did you get RF lenses or are you still using your lenses with an adapt?
Maryam: I have, I bought myself an RF 24 to 70, which is my go-to lens, um, because I’ve heard it.
Colie: You are using the 24 70 R. and you, you know, before you chuck the mirror, I mean, cuz that’s an expensive thing to chuck away, Maryam. But hey, I’m gonna check back with you
Maryam: Ha.
Colie: and see how you’re doing. what I would highly recommend is that you also attempt to use the R six mark four with an adapter and use your older lens because all of the newer lenses, and this is for Canon, Sony, you know, whatever mirrorless you have,
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: new mirrorless lenses are even sharper than the origin. So I feel like if you’re trying to find a happy medium, even though you know you won’t benefit from the corner to corner sharpness, which is why I love them,
Maryam: right?
Colie: might actually be able to get a happy medium by using your older lenses on the new body.
Maryam: Here’s my problem with that is my old 24 to 70, I’ve sent it in twice, and I’m having focus issues with it. So what I’m thinking is I might just. Really practice, uh, manual focusing and seeing if that kind of gives me the look that I’m wanting to do. So we’ll see. We’ll see what happens.
Colie: I mean, and you know what, as you just, I, I’m totally gonna use the word experiment the, title for this episode. I
Maryam: it is my favorite.
Colie: Yes. I mean, cuz I mean, so let’s talk about the experiment that you did with the Sodo. So, and it’s funny because this is not even the main reason that I brought you on here, but like this paired with the other experiments that you do in your business.
I think that it’s really interesting. what made you look at Dubsado and kind of give it a try for that whole year? Like what were you not getting from Honey Book that made you take a second look at Dubsado.
Maryam: Yeah. at the time, honey, Just did not have the customization, in terms of like the proposals and questionnaires and things like that, that I really wanted, especially because I had just gone through, you know, a very expensive branding process
Colie: Hmm.
Maryam: I wanted everything to be cohesive. You know what I mean?
Like, And so I, I really tried, I really tried free and I just, there were things that I just couldn’t get past and, and did not love. So, I will also,
Colie: you to name those because here’s the thing, Maryam, and it’s funny, you know, I used to tell people, no, if you have Honey Book or 17 Hats, Dubsado is way better. Like I used to tell people that just
Maryam: yeah.
Colie: now after you’ve switched back to Honey Book, I have actually started having more in-depth conversations with people or when people are approaching me to change initially, like they’re like,
Maryam: Umhmm
Colie: of coming to the sodo.
If they tell me that they have honey book or 17 hats, I’m like, No, I really need you to tell me what you’re not liking in your current setup, because I don’t
Maryam: Right.
Colie: to automatically, you know, just because it’s what Colie says is best. because you know, the proposals are so pretty.
mean if your system is working other. maybe you don’t need to switch. So what is it that you just couldn’t get over inside of Dubsado that you really loved and cherished inside of Honey Book?
Maryam: the biggest one, the biggest thing that I can think of off the top of my head is I do a lot , a lot of my, communications and, and work on my phone. . And so I, I don’t wanna have to be tied to the desktop I don’t wanna have to access the webpage from my web browser on my phone,
Colie: Mm-hmm.
Maryam: do things from there.
Cause it’s just not, it’s not easy to do. And so HoneyBook has an app, I can easily like, plug things in and you can pull like templates and things like that. It’s super easy. the other thing was , and this is not, you know, it’s not gonna be a problem for everyone, but I reply to emails from my Gmail, and in Dubsado when I would reply, was it, I can’t remember.
I think when I would reply through my Gmail, my reply was not in the thread.
Colie: Yes.
Maryam: In Dubsado, whereas in Honey Book, it shows you the entire thread. So like if I go into Honey Book, I can see all the emails versus just the client emails. and for me that’s important. Like I have to see , I have adhd, I need to see what I wrote, , like it needs to be easy for me to like pull an email or like find what I said before and make sure that I’m not like, you know, giving the wrong information.
So those were the two big things.
Colie: No. And Maryam, I mean, this is, this is why I have conversations with people because when people ask me if it’s not a big deal that Dubsado doesn’t have an app, I say, No, and here’s why. can do anything that you want. On the mobile app for Dubsado except write emails. I’m like, I don’t recommend that anyone write an email inside of the mobile browser for Dubo.
There’s two
Number one, it’s extremely fucking clunky. Like it’s, it’s Like if anybody wants a list of things that I wish Dubo would fix, I have a very long list, despite me being all over Instagram as like the Ssao queen. I do have a very long list, guys, of things that I think they should fix. the second thing is if you’re writing an email on the browser, And like you get an app notification in Instagram and you hop over to look on Instagram. When you come back to Dodo, it starts over and whatever email you were writing
Maryam: Uh, no
Colie: Yeah. So I mean, but the thing is, even though Dubsado has those two, you know, glaring issues, in my opinion, it has never bothered me because
Maryam: right?
Colie: and I can’t write emails on my phone.
Like I can pull. A template and change a few words and send it, but like legitimately sending emails, like my eyes are just too bad now. I, I don’t do any of that kind of stuff on my
I am way more likely to record a loom from my clients and text it to them than I am to actually answer an email. So that’s a difference in like how I run my business and why
not bother me. Could and was a complete deal breaker for you, which I completely understand. Miriam will attest to this guys, someone’s like, Hey, I have Honey Book and I wanna switch to Dubsado. like Well guys, this is why it’s great. I was like, But also I had this student that tried it for a year and then
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: to Honey Book.
So maybe you wanna ask her if, you know, ask her
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: switching. and I love to have people like that in my back pocket cuz I have, you know, hats users and.
Maryam: Oh yeah. I mean,
Colie: Tave users. Yeah.
Maryam: nothing’s gonna work for everybody. Everyone has their own like deal breakers, right? So you just need to find what’s gonna work.
Colie: And I know recently were like, Hey, I’m giving a second look. And you didn’t end up coming back, which is okay. Let’s talk about what new features Honey Book put out that like made you stay still and not jump back to Dedo for the proposal process. how are those smart files treating you, Miriam?
Maryam: So I actually, this time hired someone. I hired a VA to do all that for me. So she is because I just don’t have the time to go through and set all that up again like I did with Dubsado, because that was during the pandemic and I actually had some, But yeah, it’s going. I mean, so far so good. people have been going through the process.
I have automated more than I did before, actually. I used to be, I used to wanna be a little bit more hands on, and the way Honey Book used to have it set up is like, you couldn’t put everything in. A smooth workflow, like an automatic workflow. So like I would have to send the questionnaire myself after I sent the proposal or whatever.
Now I can literally automate everything so that it sends all that for me, and I don’t have to look at it , which I love. Yeah. So that was, that was the big thing. and now you can make it pretty, you can add, you know, the pictures and the branding and the, the fonts and all that good stuff.
Colie: Yeah, I mean those brochures are pretty, And the one thing, I mean, I updated my CRM comparison guide, which I will link in the show notes, but I did update it for Honey Book because when they put out those brochures as like, those brochures are pretty, they’re, they’re beautiful. I mean,
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: high level of customization as like a dips
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: But like that is like 90% good for like, you know, most people cause. My reason that I tell that you need a CRM that allows you to showcase at least some of your work, is that we are visual artists. We are very, I mean, what we’re selling people the photos, and in my
that I’m producing.
And so every opportunity that I have to showcase what it is that actually getting from me helps me close the sale.
Maryam: Definitely
Colie: Book put out the brochures, I was like, Oh no, that’s great. I had. I still had one complaint, and that was someone filled out a brochure, like it couldn’t automatically turn into the proposal, which allowed them to sign the contract and then pay you the money.
But with smart fields, they’ve eliminated that, right? Like you can
to proposal contract invoice. So I have no complaints anymore like
Maryam: they do all that stuff Now,
Colie: Mm-hmm.
Maryam: I think, I need to go in there. I honestly, I, I, I can’t remember if you can add video yet to the blocks, but.
Colie: video yet, as,
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: know, and I haven’t checked in at least like two months. But I mean, cuz you know, I like to be as accurate as possible. Maryam I think you know this about me. And so, you know, when someone asked me a question, I’m like, Well, you, they couldn’t do that three months ago. But let me go pop over there and see if anything has changed, because I would hate give someone incorrect information and they make a purchasing decision based on that. then it turns out that I was wrong, Like I would just feel really bad. So I try to keep to date on all of the CRMs. And guys,
Maryam: Uh, I.
Colie: for you. Like when it comes to CRMs, whatever CRM you have, you should be at least every three months, what new features they’ve released make sure that you are not missing out on something great exists in your current CRM that they put out that you just didn’t notice.
Maryam: Okay. I have to correct myself because I just, I was like, wait, I think my VA did put a video in there. there is a video in my proposal actually.
Colie: Oh
Maryam: I have a short little, like album promo that I created and it’s on there so you can add video. I don’t know how long, but
Colie: Okay. No.
Maryam: is video on there.
Colie: I am updating Okay. Guides. I guess I lied. I am not gonna put the CRM comparison guide into the notes for this one until I update it because my plan was next month. I was gonna update it and add in two new CRMs. Well, they’re not new, but they’re new in that they’re not in the current comparison
Maryam: Hm mm-hmm.
Colie: I do like to keep that up to date for all of you so that when are shopping for a crm, have a very quick way to see what features each of them have. So, am happy to know that it has video and actually, Maryam, I might hit you up to be one of your pretend clients so that you can send it to me so that I can look at it.
Maryam: Sure. Yeah, no problem. and they’re constantly like, that’s . I, I think when we were on the, This Can’t Be That Hard podcast together, talking about CRMs, I talked about like switching back and or trying other CRMs, um, because Honey Book didn’t have something at a time. And so I would look at something else and then they would add it
So I think Dubsado is probably the same, where they’re just constantly adding new updates and new things that you can do. which is one of the reasons, like in my mind, those are their top two CRMs.
Colie: I mean, and when, when it comes to automations, cuz I just wanna put this out there. I have, I have a lot of people that come to me and they’re like, Well I have 17 hats and so it’s working for me. Should I switch to Dubsado? And when they tell me that they have 17 hats, I say, Okay. But like, What is most important to you?
Like, do you want to showcase your work? If you want to showcase your work, you have to leave 17 hats. 17
no customization whatsoever. I mean, when you’re giving someone a quote, it literally looks like a receipt. Like you can put the name of the product, a description and a price. Like there’s no pictures, there’s no
Maryam: Right.
Colie: there’s no
Maryam: very dry.
Colie: It’s very, But in terms of automations, like hats does a lot of great automations. they fail in the follow up in my opinion,
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: some people that don’t need, like the following up with people and, and those kinds of things, like 17 hats is, is a great baseline crm. So when people tell me that they have it, I’m like, No.
I mean, unless you want to branch. and get proposals and get questionnaires that, you know, have some pictures in them. I mean, you can stick with 17 hats. So speaking of experimentation, Maryam, let’s talk about your pricing one of the other things that I personally know that you experimented with, and then you went back with simple sales. So tell me your experience in doing, because you and I were both all inclusive.
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: we both did simple sales. I still do simple sales for new clients,
Maryam: Mm-hmm.
Colie: simple sales you ended up going back to all inclusive. tell me about that process and how it’s working for you.
Maryam: Sure. I, I believe when I started Simple Sales, I was charging 1295 all inclusive. And so what I ended up doing was going through the simple sales process. I had base package at 1295, and then I had like, I think 1595 and then 1995 or 1795 or something like that. and so what I was seeing, number one was there was a lot more back and forth in terms of like explaining.
What the process was reminding people they had to pick a package at the end. I was running into people. Paying for the cheapest package and then coming back and be like, Actually we want the top package. And then I’d have to do like this backend stuff to like, you know, charge them extra and then let them have the access to all the images.
So there it was just, for me, it was a lot more work in terms of back and forth and things like that. And most people were buying the top package, so then I was like, I’m just gonna charge the top package price
Colie: And just be done.
Maryam: then just be done. And my clients were a lot happier because they weren’t have, having to go back and forth and like, ask me again how to do this.
And like, it was easier for them. It was easier for me. Everybody was happy. It was like a win-win . and I found that people who were, who were paying that 1295 had no problem. Leveling up and paying the 1995, so I, it wasn’t like I was trying to reach clients that weren’t gonna pay the full price.
Colie: No, I completely understand. And so just to put it out there, since when you were doing simple sales, things have changed, you can now automatically upgrade inside of the online gallery. like if your client ended up buying collection A
Maryam: Right.
Colie: C, they can do all of that themselves. So it is a hands off process, but. I do wanna say that I am really proud of you for making that decision because what you decided was that even though could see the logic in how it worked for some people, it
Maryam: Yep.
Colie: work for you and your particular clients, which is okay. Like I think what I hate to see, is when people try out something and they’re like, No, that’s just ridiculous.
It just doesn’t work when they’re trying to say that it doesn’t work. You know, overall instead of just for them and like their particular set of instances. Cause I don’t know about you, maybe it’s because I’m an educator, I get asked by a lot of people, is it to be doing all inclusive sessions And it 100% absolutely possible. You have to make sure that the price that you’re charging is profitable and sustainable. so if you didn’t get from simple sales, mean, I’m sure you were probably profitable at your 1295,
Maryam: Yeah,
Colie: way more profitable at
Maryam: definitely. Yeah.
Colie: Simple Sales just enabled you to get to that higher price point without really like losing the people that you were already photographing to begin.
Maryam: Right. And I actually, one, one family I like to, use as an example is they were a referral from a friend of mine who was going on mat leave. She had shot them once and so they had come back and I think she was charging 7 95. I was 1295 at the time they booked me. now they’re in my yearbook club.
I’ve shot them for four years in a row and they’re essentially paying $2,300 for the yearbook club package that they’ve
Colie: Mm-hmm.
Maryam: So I think a lot of people get kind of hung up on like, Well, everyone else is charging. You know, 500, 600, $700. I can’t raise my prices. No one’s gonna book me. But you dunno, that , like I said, like once I raised my prices above a certain point, like people were booking me for my work, not because they needed a photographer.
Colie: And actually let’s name that price cuz we named that price when we were offline, not recording. what price level did you actually see a difference between like the level of client that you were doing and the back and forth and people hiring you for your work and not just the price? What was that level?
Maryam: 1295 for me. Yeah. And every, I mean, I live in the Bay Area. It’s an expensive market. There are still photographers charging 5 95 for a session. I don’t know how they make any money because it’s . It’s an expensive place to live.
Colie: Yeah, no,
Maryam: But
Colie: it. You know, I live in Denver. You know, I feel
Maryam: yeah.
Colie: mean I have two mortgages and my mortgages are like very cheap to like what they could be
Maryam: Right.
Colie: them for a little while. But I mean, in general. you know, every once in a while I see people online that are in this area and they’re like, No, I’m charging 6 95, 7 95, and I just can’t go above that.
And I’m like, off the top of my head, I can name at least 12 people all using simple sales.
Maryam: Right.
Colie: I, simple sales is not the reason, guys. I’m just saying general, I know of 12 people that are you know, this much money
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: all booked. So it is not that you can’t get people to pay the higher prices. you’ll never get someone to pay you a higher price if you don’t ask. I’m just saying.
Maryam: I think it is scary to like, make that leap. And I will say that I am the secondary income in my household. so if, if I, you know, quote unquote fail, it’s not gonna ruin my family. You know what I mean? Like, I, I do have that safety net and so it does allow me a little more freedom to change things and experiment a little bit.
Worrying too much about it affecting, you know, whether I can pay my mortgage or, you know, put food on the table. So I will say that, but like that being said, you can always try charging more for six months. And if someone pushes back, you can always be like, Okay, I have this other package that is smaller and less.
just give them another option so that you can, you can charge that higher price, but have a backup if you really need it.
Colie: I mean, and let’s talk about your backup because I know for a fact that in the last two years you had your, you know, 1995, but then you also had the local only where you were, you were definitely like giving them less for less money, but then it was at a price point where you could reach more people.
So tell me about that offer and like how it worked in your.
Maryam: Well, it’s kind of funny actually, cuz it, it, it was another pandemic, pivot and so I was offering these. It’s changed a little bit now, but I was offering 30 minute, essentially mini sessions, for 1295. they were more expensive because it was, they could book ’em, you know, during the week. It wasn’t like a stacked mini session.
So I wanted it again, to be profitable for me because I was having to drive places. But people were mostly still booking my full session
Colie: Mm-hmm.
Maryam: actually don’t sell too many of the locals only sessions. Most of the people who book them are newer clients, who don’t know me and come through like, mom’s group
Colie: Mm.
Maryam: they saw on Facebook or something like that.
They’re not finding me through my website specifically. Um, the people that come through my website are booking full sessions, which is
Colie: those local only. So they’re coming through the mom group. So hey guys, that’s another little tidbit. mean mom groups get a bad name. So when people ask me ba coli, when someone posts in there, aren’t they just looking for cheap photographers? Yeah, sometimes. Sometimes
Maryam: Sometimes, yeah.
Colie: groups are totally looking for like, A photographer that doesn’t cost an arm and a leg.
You know, I hate that phrase. It is my most hate a phrase. It is like nails on a
Maryam: Same here.
Colie: You know what I have found is if someone is asking for photographer recommendations, and either I’m posting my website or one of my clients that happens to be in that group is posting my website, it’s usually not the
Maryam: Um,
Colie: made the initial request. reaches out. is someone
Maryam: yes.
Colie: who has a different budget who is not looking for like the cheapest photographer that sees my website or my work that I’ve posted, and they reach out and then they end up booking me. So, you know, moms groups get a bad name, but there are still clients to be had. So let’s talk about these people come to you at 1295 from a mom’s group. any of them upgrading to full sessions the next time that they hire?
Maryam: Um, I’ve only been doing this for about a year, so I can’t say definite.
Colie: Gotcha.
Maryam: Exactly. I haven’t had repeats yet. So for 2022, I raised my prices to 24 95. So on Black Friday last year, I, I said, I’m gonna raise my prices.
You can buy a 2022 session for, for this year’s price if you buy now. So I had one person who had been like, Like, she’s been following me for two years, never booked a session. So she booked that session and we had it this year and she was like, This is the best photography session I’ve ever had. Like, we’re definitely gonna come see you next year,
So, there’s definitely like, you’re gonna have people, and I’ve had people who follow me for a few years and can’t afford me. They just save up. Like it, it’s going back to like creating a product and experience that your, your clients will love. and I’ve put a lot of time and effort into doing that.
Not only branding, but like the actual experience from start to finish.
Colie: Yeah,
Maryam: again, I have adhd, so I don’t know if that answered your question.
Colie: I mean, you did answer my question, Miriam. but I mean, we have talked about experimentation so much. I’m loving everything that we’ve talked about. we’re gonna close the podcast with the same question that I ask every single guest, cuz it’s my favorite one. What is the biggest fuck up that you had in your business? did you learn from it and how did it change your business?
Maryam: So when I first started my business in California, it, I was a teacher in Texas. When we moved here, it daycare was so expensive, it just didn’t make sense to go back to teaching. So I decided to, you know, give my photography business a college try. And there was someone in the area who was charging like a session fee and they were including sizes, digitals, and then offering like an upgrade to full size.
So I was like, Okay, I’m gonna try that for a while.
Colie: out.
Maryam: So I was charging like 3 95 expecting people to upgrade. I know, I know. It’s embarrassing. all my aired.
Colie: mean, but it’s also like wow in that, you know, you went from, when you opened your business in California to charging 95 and now you’re charging 90, 95. And I mean, I, I just, yeah, mean,
I’m
Maryam: Yeah.
Colie: Continue
Maryam: I learned very, very quickly, very quickly that that was not sustainable or, you know, a good way to run a business. So I, I definitely jumped up very quickly, but it, that’s how I started. But I know Photo, one of my good friends here who charges the same amount as I do, she started with like a $79 living social.
And now she’s charging, you know, $2,000 a session,
Colie: Nice.
Maryam: So you know, you gotta learn. You just learn and you do better.
Colie: You know I am here for all of the pricing stories. All the pricing stories. Maryam, it has been wonderful to have you on the podcast. Go ahead and tell the listeners where they can find you, although I will have all of this in the show notes for them.
Maryam: on Instagram I am high and hello, Photo, I’m mostly on Instagram. I have a Facebook page. I rarely go on there, , so don’t reach out there. my website is high and hello photography.com. come check it out. My, my designer did a wonderful job,
Colie: job. I mean, again, I, I feel like I should give Tessa a shout out and a show notes. I
Maryam: I have sent her so many people.
Colie: I am obsessed with every website. I mean, your website and Katie’s website. And
Maryam: Yep.
Colie: actually about to do Lauras. I laugh so much because I’m like, all of the websites that I see, they’re all done by her like,
Maryam: Can I also, real quick, talking about pricing. The first time I hired her, I think I. $3,000
Colie: Yeah.
Maryam: and then this time I hired her $9,000 and it was definitely worth it. And that prob, that number’s probably shocking to some people, but is worth it.
Colie: Yeah. I think she’s over 10 now,
Maryam: Oh yeah. She has raised your prices.
Colie: Yeah. I think what you booked is now 12.
Mm-hmm.
So amazing. Well, thank you, Maryam. It was so, a pleasure to have you on. Everyone, thank you for joining see you next time.
Maryam: Bye.
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