Shifting Your Systems as You Pivot in Your Business with Erin Vestal

Colie: Hello, hello and welcome back to Business First Creatives podcast. Now guys, I want you to be a little nice today because my guest is a little nervous. She is not like most of my regular guests. She is one of my previous students in the CRM blueprint, and I don’t even remember at this point what she posted on Instagram, but I was like, oh my God, Erin, do you wanna come talk about this on my podcast?

Do you wanna come be on my podcast? To which she said yes. She has already admitted that she’s a little nervous, but she trusts me and so believe me guys, this is gonna be a good conversation. Erin, welcome to Business First Creatives podcast.

Erin: Hi, Cole. Thank you so much for having me.

Colie: Uh, it’s lovely to have you. I almost feel like we should like take a moment of silence to say, Allison, thank you so much for bringing us together.

Erin: Mm-hmm. 

Colie: So I. 

Erin: Absolutely.

Colie: I’m gonna link Allison’s episode in the show notes guys. But Allison is one of like my OG people. She was one of the beta students in the CRM blueprint and she is like one of my very first full done for you clients. But Allison and Erin are in the same area in Florida and they were doing things together and I, Allison was on my Instagram live.

That’s right, Erin. Right. She

Erin: That’s right. Yeah.

Colie: Erin dropped into my dms to ask me about what she could do for the systems in her business, which was amazing because mean, she’s, she’s grown so much. Guys, and we’re gonna talk about the this and that episode, but Erin, let’s go all the way back to like when you first found me and you first bought my course, what was your business like?

Erin: Oh my gosh, Colie. It was absolute chaos. Um, yeah, no, I, I really had just like jumped into photography full force without really knowing what I was doing. There was no game plan. So it, I think by the time I reached out to you, I, I had like thrown everything at the wall that I knew how to throw and I was like, okay, now we have to make something out of this.

’cause now I’m committed, jumped in with both feet, how do we fix this? And, uh, I think that’s about when I found you.

Colie: Yeah, so she was a student in the CRM blueprint. I know I’ve already said that guys, but I’m gonna say it a few times ’cause I like to like, you know, connect it back to how I know my guests and she ended up. Implementing like, you know, client experience systems in her business. But she is also one of those people that I talk about when I’m like, I have to look at your offer and if your offer doesn’t make sense, we have to go over it back and forth until it does.

’cause if you’re gonna take the time to create the systems to grow the sustainable business, your business has to be profitable with the offer. Right? So

Aaron, do you remember what you started with and what you ended with by the time you put the systems in place for your family Photography?

Erin: Oh man. I mean, I started with nothing. I, I think I actually purchased Dubsado because I was doing the blueprint with you. So I was like, well, if this is what Colie says I should use, this is what I’m buying. So I’m pretty sure I started with absolutely nothing built out. And I remember quite clearly at one point you telling me in awe that I was like the slowest student, you had to go through your program.

Um, and that’s always really stuck with me, but I wear it as a badge of honor now. ’cause I’m like, okay, I might be. Slow, but like, I’m intentionally methodical so it’s all paying off. I just had to like figure out what I was doing because even though you did such a fantastic job of being like, here’s how you’re gonna do everything, I really didn’t have a whole lot fleshed out or thought through except I’m really having fun and wouldn’t this be a cool business and.

Colie: Yes. I mean, I vaguely remember that your, your photography sessions were under 300.

Erin: Uh, yes, they were.

Colie: And right before we made your systems live, we did quite a jump in your prizes. I mean, I think it was like two or $300 for the session. And

you were like, Colie, no one’s gonna pay this.

And I was like, listen. Yeah, did,

did people pay it though?

Erin: They did. So you made me over double my prices. I, I like more than doubled it. And you’re like, fine, I’ll accept that for now. You’ll be so proud to know that I’ve like doubled again from that point. So we’re, we’re safely now in a profitable territory. I actually last year.

Was the first time, that I exceeded my teaching salary. So last year I felt like, oh, I’m actually like, this is a grownup job. Now. I am like, I’ve ma I’ve made it 

Colie: I mean, 

Erin: here I am making an income.

Colie: yes. And Erin, that’s quite an accomplishment for you to surpass your teaching salary because way back when, when you first started, that wasn’t even your goal. Like your goal was not to get your teaching salary, it was just

to make some kind of money from this photography business.

And

it’s something that we, that we hear and that I see so often, and when people ask me about how I priced myself, I’m very honest with people. I’m like, you know. My goal wasn’t to replace the money that I was making before because I already made six figures, and with the amount of time that I had still being a full-time parent at home with my daughter,

uh, that wasn’t gonna happen with what I could do.

I was like, but all I wanted to do was make sure that for whatever hours I put into the business, I was making the same amount of money as my husband. Was actually all I cared about. It was way less money than he was making, but I was also working way less hours than he was.

So like that was my goal for years.

Erin: Yeah. Oh, that’s brilliant. No, and I think that’s really, um. It, you know, it hits on something. That was just very true when, when I was starting my husband’s salary covered all of our expenses. Um, I was a stay at home mom. I was homeschooling our kids. Still am, stay at home homeschooling the kids, but now I run my business, so I’m not sure how to label myself anymore.

But it really, the goal changed from, oh, I want to do something fun with my time. That brings like meaning and value outside the world of parenting. And now it’s morphed into very much like the goal is to be able to live out our dreams and our values. And it’s just a more concrete, like, fleshed out vision for what our future could look like than I started with.

And so I think that’s, that really helped because it’s hard emotionally, it was hard emotionally for me to put a price on what I was offering people. ‘Cause I hadn’t experienced paying that myself, so I couldn’t fathom why someone would. Want to hire me or pay me for something that I had never done.

Um, and yet when I took the feels out of it and instead sat down with numbers and like, here’s the number of hours I can actually dedicate to this, this is the goal target where if I can bring this much in through my business, that allows our family to have. You know, this set of opportunities that we wouldn’t have otherwise.

And then you break it down that way, it became so much less emotional and so much more, well, this is just what it has to be like, this is my business and this is what it’s gonna take. So, this is what it’s, you’re gonna have to pay,

Colie: Erin, you sound like such a grownup now. Oh my gosh.

And the funny thing is I hope that everyone listening knows this is not something that you do one time and then it just works. I am personally going through like a revamping of my numbers, if you will. I’m actually in someone’s program to go through and like look at my numbers.

And the funny thing is she, I. Think is very used to working with people that struggle to look at their numbers and

struggle to price. And I’m like, no, none of that is my problem. Like if I’m feeling salty, I will double my prices overnight. Like, I don’t do that. I, you know, I’m good. But what, what was really interesting for me to try to explain to her was when I put in all of our personal expenses and she was like, okay, so this is what you wanna make.

And I’m like, well, no. Like, where can I put in the percentage that I wanna be? Responsible for. I was like, I’m gonna put in 50% to be nice, but I don’t need to pay 50% of our personal expenses. Like my husband makes that so

like.

It is a very privileged place to be when you are not the sole breadwinner.

But I did want to look at the numbers. So that I knew, hey, if my husband is suddenly unemployed, what does that look like when I am responsible for everything versus what it looks like for me to pay like, you know, half or then for me to pay the percentage that I actually need to pay to make us go forward.

But I am so happy that like now you’re like, these are my numbers, so that we can live the life that we want and the values. And Erin, I had no idea that you were still homeschooling your kids. So

let’s just take a minute and go there. So in

any given week. What does your work schedule look like right now?

Because when I was homeschooling Chloe, like, we went through a couple different phases. So just like right now, because your kids are, I’m assuming you’re, you’re schooling them right now.

Um, what does an average week look like for you?

Erin: Ooh. Okay. That’s a good question. What I’ve started leaning on really strongly is time blocks. And I know that’s like schedule and maintenance 1 0 1, but for me it was a revelation that you could break your day into pieces and assign tasks to those pieces and go for it. So the, like the overall family life is.

Monday through Thursday, half of the day is my work time. The kids have a list of independent tasks, so their chores, their independent learning that I want them to be responsible for, it shouldn’t need me. Like right now, this week’s been a little crazy ’cause we’re trying to get back into the swing of things and so they’re needing me a lot and I’m like, oh yeah, this is why it’s better not to break our routine because they do know this.

You know, all the refreshers. Um, but usually that gives me a few hours, like three, if I’m lucky of uninterrupted work time where I can really focus in on, um, whatever the work task is for the day. And then the other half of the day is our lesson time. And so that’s when we sit down and we do school together or do, you know, outings or whatever, whatever’s on the docket.

but then to really make it efficient, what I found is Monday through Thursday, I’ve assigned. What the group of tasks are gonna be. So I’m not doing a lot of task switching, so I think it was. Oh, gosh, it must have been a year or two ago you had a podcast episode all about CEO days and how you should like set admin days on your calendar.

So thanks to that episode, my Mondays are my admin day where I, like, I do my daydreaming, I plan out my goals, I like check my numbers, whatever is on the docket. Um, and then the rest of the week alternates between like marketing, editing, what, you know, all the, all the photography ish stuff, that you have to do.

And then. Fridays, my husband’s in charge of everything, house and kids, and I duck out. And that’s my big full focus marketing day where I, I get bigger projects done and can really, um, focus without having to be responsible for other people. And that’s that. I think the Fridays have been my game changer once we figured that out.

And, yeah, he take, he takes that on. And then, yeah, weekends are, are pretty much family time. And then if I’ve got a wedding or a session. Obviously that those come on the weekends, but otherwise, yeah,

Colie: I mean, all of that sounds so amazing, and I’m gonna remind people of what my homeschooling journey was, because in a lot of ways it sounds very similar to Erin’s. So first we started with COVID learning, which I don’t really think counts, but let’s go

there. My kid was home, she was virtual learning, but

she had a full-time teacher on her computer screen.

So I wasn’t doing anything.

Then there’s the year where she did full virtual school again. Um, it wasn’t with her home teacher from her school, but she was still somebody else’s responsibility. And then we did the next year, which is when everything started to break down. Um, we ended up homeschooling her officially because she, we started to see some things that she really needed with reading that she wasn’t going to get in the environment that she was in.

And so I hired like a reading specialist. She was doing two sessions a week, and then it doubled to four sessions a week, and then it turns out that that still wasn’t enough. So then the next year was when Chloe went back to school full-time, but between two different schools. And that was

actually the worst year of business for me because there was no downtime.

There was no,

Hey, Aaron, you got three hours? Yeah, I didn’t get that. But the glorious part was Fridays, which I find it amusing that it’s your Friday too. But in my husband’s previous job, he was a Sunday through Thursday. Person. And so he had Fridays off, and so Friday I wasn’t responsible for anything. He had to deal with Chloe taking her back and forth between the two schools, like he was doing all of that.

And

that was the only day that I could do CRM setups. So if you hired me

to do your setup, it happened on a Friday because it was literally

the only day that I had. Yes. Um, but I feel like those of us that were homeschooling. Like, you know, balancing either, either homeschooling or just having young children at home. The more that you can time block and the more that you can kind of protect your CEO time on your calendar, the more successful you are going to be because you’re never wondering, oh, when am I going to be able to work on this? When

it’s clearly on your calendar and you have the structure to support that.

Erin: Right. Well, and I think it was such a game changer too, because it eliminated all of the decision making. So before I was doing that, I would finally get that space where I’m like, okay, I can sneak away. I’ve got some time. I can do work. And I’d sit down and I would just spin my wheels like. What should I do?

And then you start to feel overwhelmed. ’cause you’re like, there’s so much you could do in your business, right? Like the possibilities are endless. And so having it instead like pre-thought out. So that’s actually my Sunday afternoon activity. I like sit down cup of tea. Like I plan out, here’s my goals, here’s what’s gonna help me this week to move the needle on them.

So then when I sit down the day of, I already decided what I’m gonna do, it’s, it’s just a matter of like, okay, do I wanna start with task A or task B? Because they’re both gonna get done today. So that’s made such a big difference too, just not having the decision fatigue at the front. Any brain power I’ve got in that moment gets funneled towards whatever the task is, and then it’s just been a lot more effective, I think, than what I was doing before.

I felt busier before. Like this morning I finished my stuff and I was like, I guess I don’t know what else to do. Like that was like, that was, that was it for today. We, we did it. Um, question mark, but in another way it’s like, well, that’s the whole point of business, right, is I didn’t set up this business because I wanted to be busy, like I have enough in my plate, without having to make up extra things for myself and.

That’s been a big shift then is going from the busyness of all you could do to really like, no, this is effective, this is efficient, this is moving my needle, and that’s enough. Like it, it can just be enough.

Colie: Do you still feel like your business is very seasonal? And I’m asking this because the two things that you really, that you really photograph are weddings and families

and families. I mean, you’re in Florida. Let’s, let’s, let’s actually say this for the listening audience. She’s in Florida guys, so

she can literally photograph families year round.

Are you photographing? 

Erin: um, okay. I try my best not to photograph people here summer through fall. Because it’s very, very stormy. So, um, like most days we’re in a rainy season, so, so it starts in May, it ends at the end of November. For a lot of that you’ve got a popup thunderstorms all the time. There’s always, there’s always lightning.

And I don’t do lightning rain’s fine. Lightning, no. And so I find photographing families during this season really stressful because I’ve got my eye on the like 10 weather apps and I’m trying to make sure no, nobody’s in harm and like, this is gonna work. Or do we need to shuffle our times? So I find, um, you know, when holiday season starts through, spring is really lovely.

It’s usually dry, it’s sunny. It might be a little chilly, but I just throw on a sweater. It’s, and okay. Full disclaimer, when I say chilly, it’s like 60 degrees. Maybe it’s 70 on the beach and you’re like, Ooh, I could, you know. So we’re not talking full winter coats, and I understand. I’m actually from up north and I thought it was silly until I stayed here long enough.

I, I swear your blood thins and it’s like a thing. It’s not uncommon vacationers, um, to come through. And so I’ll end up with some throughout the summer and early fall. Most of my local families I photograph, we actually aim for late winter, early spring.

And so I’ll do like a little holiday session with them, just complimentary, you know, in November usually where, you know, we can get them a Christmas card or holiday card, what have you. But then our actual session, it’s like, it’s so much more relaxed if you can. Push that, push that on in the calendar a little bit and, and know you’re good.

And then weddings are the same. So the big wedding season starts in fall, goes through spring. Not often will you find people doing it in summer. And when they, when they do, it’s just really hot. It’s 

Colie: And you’re like, I have no interest in that. I

Erin: I don’t, 

Colie: When people ask me why I actually don’t photograph people outside, I, I tell them it is my anxiety. Like, I don’t like being outside with the elements and having to figure out what I will get when I am in

your house. At least, at least there are walls to cover us.

You know what I mean? Like,

and I don’t care how much 

Erin: have shelter?

Colie: windows. Yeah, it’s fine.

But when I go outside, it’s like, oh. Is the sun gonna cooperate? Is it gonna rain? And here in Colorado, like lots of people will not cancel for rain because it usually only rains for like 10 minutes.

And then you have the

most beautiful skies outside to take your photos. But I don’t, I don’t like that. Like that’s just not me.

And I also find it very interesting what you said about you give them the complimentary, session in November to get the Christmas card or the holiday card and then you’re photographing them in winter.

Because that’s what I tell a lot of people who live in winter states to do in order to get people to

do in-home sessions in winter, like give them an outdoor

photo in October or November.

So that they have something for their Christmas card, but make their main session in home in winter because then you’re not worried about the weather and you’re

not, you know, trying to shove in a hundred families in like a two and a half month period.

’cause we also

don’t do fall here.

There is no 

Erin: Oh no. 

Colie: It’s like seven days

and you can never predict when the seven days of fall will be. Like, literally the leaves turn overnight. Like they’re, they’re

beautiful yellow, and then it’s all brown and they’re all off the trees. Like you just.

It’s so fast.

Erin: I never would’ve thought that. But that’s, see, and I think that’s brilliant, right? And it’s the, it’s the problem solving about how we can do what we love in the place where we are and not have it just drive us to absolute insanity to manage. I don’t know.

One of my pet projects lately has been, there’s a couple of other places in America that I just adore. Like I have family or really close friends there, and it, it’s a whole new scenery, right? There’s no palm trees and beaches. It’s like pine forests or lake friends, so whatever. And so the last year or so, I’ve been working on building connections there and starting to plan and do more photography there.

Um, so I’m hoping to get going for Minnesota weddings in like June when it’s really pretty and you know, everybody’s all excited to be there and it’s just a different, a different atmosphere. Um, and I’ve been doing early fall sessions in Andover, up near Boston because again, you’ve got all the colors and there’s pumpkin patches and like all of the fun stuff that we don’t have here in Florida that I really, really love, but I can’t live there ’cause like.

We’re here.

Colie: Because like cold, you can’t live

Erin: yeah. Right, because as we’ve established, my blood is like too thin. I would freeze. So that’s been kind of another way too, where I think sometimes we box ourselves in, we’re like, oh, this is what I’ve got. And it’s like, well, there’s actually a world of possibilities. You know, if, if you’re open to being creative or saying, oh, this appeals to me, I could.

I could go do some work here and make this my setup. So I’ve got some families that it’s our annual tradition. I just emailed them in July and I’m like, here are my fall dates. And they say, okay, we’ll see you on this one. And um, and that’s that. And then it funds my trip to see family and friends and that’s convenient.

Um, so it’s just fun. I think that’s the biggest thing is starting. The business felt like such a heavy pressure, like, I’ve gotta figure this out now that I know this is gonna be a thing and I spent all this money and now it’s a little more like, oh, I really don’t prefer sweating through a session in August.

So I’d rather be in Minnesota doing a wedding or you know, just having a month off with my family.

Colie: I mean, you have bought yourself the luxury of doing sessions where you want in the season that you’re happy with, and that’s so amazing.

I purposely waited until we did this episode so that I could ask you, because when I started seeing you share weddings on Instagram, I was puzzled.

So how did you start offering weddings on top of the family session?

Erin: Oh, okay. So I. I early, man, we were probably, I was a couple of years in and I had come across wedding photography. Well, obviously everybody does, right? Like we all know it’s a genre, it’s a thing. And I think it was on a whim, somebody called me up and they’re like, Hey, there’s this wedding expo and you could have a booth.

And I was like, I don’t do this. But it, it kind of made me think about it and pause for a minute. I was like, well, that could be fun. So I found a styled shoot up in Tallahassee, and I went up there and I had the time of my life. Like these other photographers just dazzled me. They’ve got all this like fancy gear.

I’ve got like my natural light, you know, I’ve got my one camera. They’re, they’re like popping stuff up everywhere. And it was just so fascinating to meet them and hear their stories and see how they worked. And I was like, Ooh. This is really compelling. Like, I wonder if I would like this. And the styled shoot was super fun.

So I thought, okay, I will go and do this expo and you know, I’ll show the pictures I took at the styled shoot and just see. And so there were a couple of couples that I met who I ended up booking and um, you know, fast forward a year because weddings, you know, are, are an instantaneous thing. So I photographed their weddings and I absolutely loved it.

And I thought, okay, this is fun. Like. I was sure I’d be really stressed and I wasn’t. I just really enjoyed it and it’s, you know, everything’s done up to be so pretty. And I was very fortunate too, the couples I photographed really loved each other and their families really loved loving them. So it was, it was all just very positive, um, which I think is the epitome of what a wedding should be, right?

We, we hope that’s what we’re getting to do when we walk into a wedding situation. And so it was after I delivered those that I thought, okay, you know, this was, this was good. I got my feet wet. I, I experimented, saw the whole process through. And so that’s when I started really flushing out the systems, making sure that any other couples who came my way were gonna have like, the best experience with me.

It was gonna be high level, high touch, like, everything I dreamed for the people I work with. And then that’s when the spring, I really started hitting it hard. So doing a lot of wedding expos really. Marketing myself and saying, Hey, this is something I care to do. So there were like two years behind the scenes where I was like, putting the foot on the gas, taking it off.

Maybe I don’t wanna do this. I, I think there was one part in there where I was so horrified that I had thought this was a good idea, that I like, threw out all of the promotional stuff that I had made for expos. ’cause I’m like, I don’t, I don’t know about this. This is really spooky. What have I gotten myself into?

So I have since. Reordered and repurchased all of those things. Um, because of course then after the actual wedding came, I was like, oh no, it was my lack of systems that was freak freaking me out. It wasn’t the actual wedding and photographing that experience, it was not knowing what I was supposed to do with them ahead of time.

So, we got that sorted out. So now there, there are wedding systems built in. And so yeah, just experimenting with it again, seeing what happens.

Colie: Well, and I love that you, you know, you tipped, you dipped your toe

for the creative aspect,

Erin: Privately. Privately dipped my toe.

Colie: Yes, but it’s also, I don’t wanna say it’s strange because then that comes off as like judgmental, but it’s totally not. But I don’t know that I know many people that go from doing families to getting the wedding book. It’s usually the reverse. It’s usually wedding photographers that are spending every weekend doing weddings and they eventually get tired of them. And so then they move on to do something like family photography

or branding photography or something else that doesn’t require them to spend all their weekends. And the thing about you, Erin. I now realize is that for you, it doesn’t really seem like you’re, you know, I don’t wanna say wasting your weekends away from your kids because you’re with them every day of the

week. And so, you know, for other people it’s like, well, my kids are in school, you know, Monday through Friday and the weekends is when I really get to spend that quality time with them.

But for you, it’s the opposite. You’re getting a lot of quality time

Erin: Oh, so much quality time. Oh, yes.

Colie: So, I mean, from that perspective, I think it’s interesting. I also love the fact that you were like, okay, it’s not that I hate the weddings, it’s that I didn’t have the systems in place, and then you took the time to put the systems in place so that then you weren’t really getting bogged down. By the administrative work, you were able to really enjoy the creative part

of photographing weddings, which of course, I think would be the most beautiful part, which I don’t know. I’ve never photographed a wedding that is like the one thing that I have

stayed far, far away from.

Erin: Oh, that’s funny. Yeah, no, it’s creative and I think what I realized is the, the thread, and part of what I had done too is I had privately made a whole separate website for weddings. I was like. Okay. I don’t wanna mess up this great, beautiful thing that I’ve created. I’m gonna set up a whole new thing so that I don’t ruin anything.

I even had like a whole separate brand in Dubsado so that I didn’t have to figure out like how to change my signature and all of that. And, um, as I was, as I was going through it and realized, you know, it’s not, it’s not that this is a wedding and this is a family and a family person doesn’t care about weddings or wedding.

People don’t wanna see babies like. It, the common thread in everything is I just, I find people so fascinating and I love being able to see a little peek into their story and who they are and what they love and like what makes them tick. And once I identified that thread. It. It revealed this whole way to bring it all together.

And that’s, I think when you were starting to see it on Instagram. ’cause I’m like, okay, we don’t have to have my whole separate brand. I mean, I think for a while I had like a newborn Instagram, a family Instagram and a wedding. Instagram and Colie. I like don’t even do social media. 

Colie: I mean, but how were you doing that.

and homeschooling your kids? Oh.

Erin: see this is the problem. So, um, this year it was really the year where I was like, okay, now that I see this thread, we’re gonna bring everything together. We’re gonna put all the systems in one place. I did a big rebranding thing with, an absolutely fantastic, uh, web designer who helped make sure I didn’t totally destroy everything I had built up.

’cause I was like, no, this needs to, this needs to be one business. I’m one person, so I’m not gonna pretend I’m like this mega. Entrepreneur, I am, I’m like a mom who’s running a business she loves, but also has these other responsibilities. So we brought it all together, um, got the system sorted, and now it feels a lot more grounding, like, okay, here’s how we can go.

And circling back where you were talking about, like knowing your numbers, it was so helpful then with the weddings, because I, I already knew from families. What number felt like a good number of times a month to leave the house or like, or let’s be honest, a week. There’s, there was that sweet spot where if I was gone too much, it started to just like everything at home felt a little too stretched thin.

I felt too stretched thin. And so, um, you know, it was really, then it just was looking at weddings and saying, okay, if I already know, this is my sweet spot for families. Well, you know, let’s say I took two family sessions off the table in a month and I put one to two weddings on, because to your point, most of them are happening on Saturdays.

You know, occasionally it’ll be a Friday or a Sunday, but usually it’s a Saturday. So swap it out and then, you know, you just, you do all your fancy maths and you, you sort it all out and make sure all the numbers are right. But that felt really empowering too, to know, okay, now this is a vision for what fully booked would look like.

This is a vision for what the goal is. I really only want. This many wedding clients and now that means for families and newborns. The goal has changed a little bit, back because I don’t wanna be gone all the time. But I do really love my homeschool time not being interrupted. So it’s just a way to figure out how to fit the business.

I love creating into what is my current available time and family life and. You know, bring it. Bring it all together.

Colie: You make the business fit in the season of life that you’re in,

and I find it so fascinating that you were trying to have everything

separate and then you decided to put it all together. I honestly feel like the only thing that I’m uncomfortable having on one website is family photography and bourgeois. Like, I don’t think in my mind that I could ever mix the two, but almost

Erin: It might be a 

Colie: else, everything else, I feel like it can go on one website. And it’s just about the thread that you said that you found and then also like the different pieces that you have on the website to make it work.

I mean also maybe if you were doing real estate photography that is just, I don’t wanna call it sterile, I’m as, I’m sorry if anybody listening is a, is a real estate photographer, but like that is something else that I would put on like its own Instagram.

’cause there’s no emotion.

In real estate photography, and I feel like all the things that you talked about, weddings, families, newborns, they’re all very emotional, um, photography sessions

and so. I would probably separate it, you know, in that way. But otherwise, I’m happy that you were able to bring everything together and that

you felt really confident in like setting your goals for each of them to make sure that you, you know, surpassed your teaching salary.

Yay.

So what’s next? What is still troubling you are you in a season now of like ease where everything is going good and you are just, you know, going with it?

Erin: Oh, okay. I wish I could say yes. I was just in a season of ease. But in all fairness, it’s my own fault. I’m not, I had another project in mind, so I am launching into that because in true air fashion I like to. I like to throw myself at the inspiration when it strikes. I’m gonna backpedal, before we got on, you asked me if there’s anything that has just really led to my ability to grow as a business woman, as a photographer, and.

So there’s a group of, other photographers that I’ve actually never met in person, but we’ve been meeting weekly for the last two years and we call ourselves a photography mastermind. We spend like three hours together once a week. Talking all things, well now it’s personal life too, but it was business and personal life.

And meeting with them regularly has really, has really opened my eyes too. When I started and you take all these educators classes, there’s, this is how you do it. And it took me some time. I think this is why I was slow in the start. It took me some time to figure out, oh, that really is, is wonderful for you.

I’m so glad that’s how you do it. That’s not going to work for me. Um, it’s not gonna work for my stage of life or my interests or my personality, or what have you. And so this group of, this group of other women has really helped me also become aware of my strengths as a business woman. There are things that I didn’t know I was so good at until they start.

They’d look at me and be like, wow. And then there’s other things that I’m like, oh, I am really not. Top tier at this task because I watch my friends do it and I think, oh, that’s what gifted at that looks like. And I don’t have that. And so, so this year is the year of kind of looking at that and accepting who I am.

And without getting too like big about it and like into, into all the other aspects where I could go, I feel like. What I’m trying to do now is take this business that I’ve envisioned, make it very concrete with the systems, right? So the whole, whole Q1 and Q2 were like making sure my systems were ironed out into the nth degree.

And now it’s about saying, okay, if I want this to be sustainable for my life and continue to grow and continue to bring me joy and not burn me out, I think I’m at that tipping point where some things. Need to stay on my plate, because it’s me. So like talking with clients or doing sales calls or, showing up at the wedding expos in person to talk to prospective clients, and couples.

That, that’s something I enjoy doing. It brings me life and I’m good at it. There are other things like social media that I am just really not great at. I don’t use it in my personal life. I don’t really like being there. But I do know it’s important. It’s important to build out that brand ecosystem.

It’s important to be showing up and to show people who you are and what you care about. And like, I, I wholeheartedly believe all of. The things that, you know, everybody says about it. I just also, I go to do it and I’m like, oh boy. Like all my energy SAPs out of me. I’m depressed afterwards. I’m unhappy. And so,

right now the big project is looking for somebody, to hire, to bring onto my team to be my first ever employee, which, feels like a big, a big grownup responsibility. But I also think very, very much believe that that’s the way to grow and take the next step to become. The fullest vision of what I’m picturing for myself and for my business.

So, that’s, that’s the current project, which is a little overwhelming. I have my first, uh, my first interview tomorrow morning actually, to, to see if the first candidate is going to be a good fit or not. And I’m sure there’s gonna be a lot of learning curves with that, with delegating and learning how to communicate and, there’s a lot of responsibilities.

But I also think there’s gonna be a really good payoff if somebody can help take the tangled mess. That is my marketing. And I’ve got great idea. Generations. I just don’t, I just don’t do them, or not quickly. I will do them eventually, but I’ll be like so far behind that it’s not worth playing the game.

Colie: Erin. That’s amazing. Now I have a, I have a very pointed question. So

first of all, you use the word employee. Are you actually hiring them as an employee or as a contractor?

Erin: They’ll be a va so they’ll be a part-time 

Colie: That’ll be it. Okay. And then is this literally the first time that you have outsourced something or is

this just the fir. Okay.

Erin: Oh, well, okay. Let me backpedal. I, I, earlier this year I did start outsourcing my editing, so that felt really huge to me ’cause I felt like I should do it. My editor now is fantastic. I just need them to make sure my, yeah, I was like, I just need consistency. And then I can go in, I’m spending the same time editing, but now it’s leveling up the pictures to the idea that’s in my mind.

Instead of spending the whole time trying to get my white balance, set across an entire session, that’s vastly terrible lighting situations I put myself into. , So yes, technically they were my first outsource, and now this will be my first like. It’s 

Colie: But also this is two in one year though. Okay.

Erin: It is? Yeah. Yeah.

Colie: mean, I don’t know that you know this, but I mean, so I outsourced my editing very early because of my eyes. But my first, like two people that really like considerably took things off my plate, were my podcast manager and my virtual assistant,

and I hired them both in the same week.

Erin: I didn’t know 

Colie: I mean, I have a podcast episode I’m gonna send you about it so you can listen to it. But yeah,

I hired, and it was actually three years ago. Next week? Yeah, three years

Erin: Really?

Colie: I hired both of them in the same week. And it was funny because when I interviewed Sarah, I was like, okay, so here’s the thing. I don’t actually know what I need you to do yet. I just know that I need to find somebody. Like there’s tasks. I’m sure

I was like, , first thing is my podcast. I said, but I’m interviewing a podcast manager in two days, and I’m fairly certain I’m hiring her, but if I don’t, that will be the first thing that I assign to you.

But if I do, these are the things that I’m thinking of and we’ll just take it from there. But like literally two people, and I mean, and it’s, it’s kind of like, oh, wow. I went from not owing anybody except my bookkeepers. I don’t feel like bookkeepers count, but yeah.

Erin: No, ’cause you have to have somebody helping do number things.

Colie: Well, I don’t, but I did it because, uh,

my time, 

Erin: don’t you, have a skillset related to that? Like I feel like, I feel like you had a little bonus qualification there. Come tax season, I want someone else telling me like, this is for sure. Good.

Colie: Well, what my husband would say is every, every tax season, I would literally lock myself in the office for three days straight. I mean, barely any sleep, barely any

food, because I was doing all of my expenses in three days. So it

isn’t the numbers that drove me insane. It was that, you know.

Finding the time to actually do it. Yeah. And so now it’s great because I just look at, you know, my QuickBooks, it’s all done. I’m just like, Ooh, this is the number I spent on advertising. Oh wow. This is the amount I spent on travel. Like, I’m just like copying and pasting into the, into the tax. So

it’s, it’s all good. I mean, Erin, so I have loved every little bit of our conversation and I am like. Sincerely, so happy that your business has taken off in the way that it has because when I think back when you, when you first bought my course and you first came into my world, like, you know, none of this was really what you envisioned as your success, but you

are definitely in your successful business era now.

Erin: Yeah. No, I, when you first found me, I was like this poor little lost soul. And I’m pretty sure looking at me back then from your eyes must have been like, I hope she does Okay. But like a little bit of a question mark after that. But no thank you. It’s, it’s. It’s really been a fun journey, and I think that it’s been so helpful, you know, through all the ups and downs of businesses to have, to have you as a resource, to have other mentors in the space who are able to kind of push you along and say, no, don’t lose hope.

Like, let’s try this. Like give it another go. It’s made a world of difference because I, I really don’t know. I would’ve found systems eventually. I really don’t know. How great they would’ve worked for me if I hadn’t found you and I did. And like gotten that sorted out right from the get go.

Colie: And it’s funny because, yesterday I did an episode, well, this is gonna be like at least two months before this airs, but yesterday I did an episode where I was talking about the fact that, you actually don’t need systems to make six figures. And of course I said it very pointedly and I

laughed a lot in the episode and I’m like, no.

Like you can totally make a lot of money without systems, but do you know what systems give you? Systems give you ease?

And so I Sanity.

So I am really looking forward to sharing this episode because there are a lot of people who think, well, I’m in the beginning stages of my business and I don’t quite know where I need it to go.

Erin: Mm-hmm.

Colie: And I’m not quite charging sustainable prices yet.

And until I do those things, I don’t need systems.

And yes, guys, you can totally make money as a photographer, as a business owner without like, and when I say CRM, when I say systems, right now I’m talking about CRM systems,

but the. Ability that it will give you to grow your business as you go, and kind of the confidence that it will give you in charging prices that are appropriate

for the service that you are selling cannot be underestimated.

Erin: No. Well, and I really, you know, it felt like such a slow grow for so long. However, all of that work, building that foundation by having systems laid out to say, this is the level of client care I want. This is how I actually want my life to look, so let’s, let’s figure it out now before there’s like so much to have to backpedal on or juggle.

It didn’t feel like a ton of progress at the time. But now, this year, as I’m looking at hiring, hiring help to, to assist me and I’m, I’m looking at, okay, now we can actually be more outward facing and start marketing. And I probably could have done that part sooner. Um, I might’ve been making excuses for myself on the marketing front, but when we build that foundation first, I really think it helps our businesses grow more sustainably in the long term, because we’re not either gonna burn ourselves out, like running and being really.

I was gonna say flashy, but that’s not kind. ’cause there’s, there’s some really cool people who are really good at showing what they do to the outside world. I just, like, we’ve already established, I don’t have that skillset. Um, you know, there’s some things like that where it’s like, okay, it gives you that like quick, oh, maybe that’s from a greatest way.

It gives you that quick like firework where people see you and are like, oh, you’re a thing. And you can maybe pick up some steam with that. For myself, it’s brought me a lot of comfort to know. Okay. Now when people find me, I’m gonna be able to stand behind my work, or I’m gonna be able to stand with an experience that backs me up for the numbers that I have set in front of my, in front of my packages so that they can say, oh no, this was worth it.

We are reassured 100% good choice. Um, and then that starts cycling through and, and building up really positively. So maybe a long-term slow game, but a, a end game with a long-term. Slow in the fu, you know what I mean?

Colie: I actually do,

Erin: That like the words are failing me. This is why social media posts are hard. It’s not gonna maybe be that instantaneous result right now, but it will pay off dividends in the long run.

That’s what I was going for.

Colie: Okay, so how are you feeling about the episode now? I think that this was absolutely fantastic. I think that the stories that we have told are amazing, and part of like my goal for this year is to make sure that I am highlighting more like what I would consider to be an everyday photographer instead of those of us that, you know, also do mentoring and education on the

Erin: Yeah.

Colie: I really do want to get back to highlighting like, I mean, and it’s mostly gonna be my students, I’m gonna be honest because I know them better than I know anybody else.

if Erin’s story has excited you, don’t worry. I have some more to come. Erin, thank you so much in joining me in this episode.

Erin: Thank you so much, Colie, for having me. It was an absolute joy.

Colie: Everyone. I hope that listening to Erin’s story, and I mean maybe I can even say putting systems first and how it helped her grow her business, has maybe given you a little bit of inspiration to take a few hours this week and work on systems yourself. Alright, that’s it for this episode. See you next time.